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How to deal with medical doubts of Prostate Sonograms and 3D Clinic?

by Quarry

Ron,

I recently did an internet search to see where the 3D Clinic is located within China. I was surprised to find several headlines just under the top of the page which hosted comments by many apparently aggrieved former patients at the 3D Clinic who presented themselves as medically worse off, in significant pain, and very much out of pocket too for their 3D experience. This was about a month ago, so I forget all the details, but a frequent complaint was that they were being injected in the testicles and penis as well as the prostate, and that the clinic injects cortisone (or some other inappropriate medication) in some patients. That’s a little scary. After reading that, anyone would feel the need for a higher standard of credibility of evidence that 3D is everything it claims to be. I myself was bewildered by 3D’s claim of a success rate of “up to 95%”. “Up to 95% could be literally as low as 5%, or anything in between. It has to be either 95%, or something else, or a fluctuating range.

On your website, you have a link to a defence of the 3D Clinic from such accusations. But the link is dead. So I’ve hit a brick wall. As a prominent advocate for 3D, have your own symptoms been satisfactorily eliminated after three trips (I think) to the 3D Clinic? Do you still have to catheterise yourself intermittently, as before 3D, or never now? The one improvement you have mentioned that I know of is that your prostate size was halved from 200 to 100. Has it regrown at all since? Have any of your symptoms returned?

In my own adventures with mainstream medicine, my sonogram done two days after catheterisation for urinary retention measured my prostate at 59g/ml. Just 9 weeks later it was re-measured by another sonographer in a different location at 178g/ml. That’s a 300% difference in 9 weeks. I’m still trying to obtain a satisfactory explanation for this vast discrepancy, but the doctors I’ve consulted consider this astonishing anomaly to be of no significance or interest.
I’ve been told by “experts” that prostate volumes grow slowly, and that an increase of 119g/ml in 9 weeks is not possible. “Expert” medical explanation: one of the sonographers was incompetent.

How much trust should anyone put in a technology where different sonographers can measure the same organ so very differently? The discrepancy makes a mockery of the value and reliability of ultrasound testing - unless prostates can swell by 300% in 9 weeks.

I asked the doctors if the discrepancy could be explained by my prostate reacting to something and swelling. If my prostate could swell 300% as a reaction (perhaps connected with 2 weeks of continuous heavy internal bleeding), it could then also shrink by 300%, as with a swollen ankle. The doctors (urologists and GPs) told me that prostates only enlarge, never shrink (a statement revealing their medical ignorance).
I’m wondering if the presence of the catheter itself might be causing prostatitis or an allergic reaction or irritation which has caused my prostate to swell, and that therefore both sonographers were accurate in their measurements. Perhaps I was infected during the insertion of the catheter.

My own experience might possibly be sceptically applied to your own 100g/ml prostate shrinkage after 3D. Was the 100 figure measured at the 3D Clinic and the 200g/ml figure measured in Canada? Perhaps if you were to have another ultrasound of your prostate in Canada you might find it’s still 200 in Canada. This speculation is just based on my own experience of sonagrams as being unreliable, with results varying wildly from sonographer to sonographer (assuming my prostate didn’t swell temporarily - an impossibility, according to my urologist).

I seem to remember reading that your prostate was measured by MRI in China. I’m wondering if MRI and ultrasound technologies might produce different measurements. Were both your 200 and 100 prostate measurements taken by MRI in China? Have you ever double-checked the measurement in Canada? Is MRI technology more accurate than ultrasound?

If sonographers’ accuracy and reliability can vary by 300%, then how can anyone make critical decisions based on ultrasound reports?

-----

Ron here....

There are always negative comments about anything on the web.

The website may have been down for tech reasons but my links worked just now without a problem.

You can read about the hepatitis claim on the 3D site... it was another doctor who Dr Song trained who opened his own clinic and "bad-mouthed" Dr Song. I believe fully Dr Song's explanation.

As to other patients results, I would ask the clinic for as many references as possible that you can contact and speak to. This will help you with your decision.

If you want details of my situation do a search for "3D" on my site...

In very brief, I had a prostate embolization before the 3D treatment that has drastically affected my ability to discharge the particles from the breaking up of the nodules of BPH. As a result I have not been able to eliminate all my symptoms. But a "normal" patient would not have my problem. And when you see the particles in your urine bottle after collecting during the night, then you will see for sure that the treatment is working. I did discharge some but not in the amount I saw in other patients.

I know of 2 patients whose prostate had swollen so far up into the bladder that the needles could not reach there. This is a new condition that Dr Song had never seen before. He is working on a solution to that problem.

With my own eyes I have seen other patients cured including 2 with advanced prostate cancer. Check out their testimonials. They are for real.

As to different sonogram results, I do not bother with constant testing. I do believe that irritation, infection, reaction to some kind of input etc, can cause a temporary extra spike in the prostate size. So that may explain some variation.

I have been doing more research into the gut biome as it seems to be the area of health that can explain so much of our chronic problems. It could be why I get a prostate attack after eating something that my prostate does not like! There must be a link for that between the gut and the prostate. I hope to be able to break that chain some day.

I may go back again to the clinic as it seems I am able to discharge and absorb small amounts from the treatment. But I am not typical as my blood flow to the prostate has been severely restricted by the PAE. You need that blood flow to cleanse and remove the debris.

Hope this helps you.

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